| Sat, Jul 31 2010 09:45am IST 1 |

Tony
1984 Posts
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I was listening this morning to an old Kinks hit from 1965 on
'Sounds of the Sixties' called 'See my friend sail across the
river'.
Question: what part of speech is 'sail'?
As a normal verb: 'My friend sails across the river' it would have
an 's', or 'My friends sail across the river' - no 's' with a
plural subject.
But neither 'See my friend sail across the river' nor 'See my
friends sail across the river' have an 's' on 'sail'.
You could substitute 'sailing' (a present participle?) but is
'sail' a participle in this construction, too, without and
'ing'?
Can anyone throw any light, please?
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| Sat, Jul 31 2010 01:43pm IST 2 |

Weens
993 Posts
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Is it not just present tense? Der! I'm useless with this kind of
thing.
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| Sat, Jul 31 2010 01:44pm IST 3 |

Weens
993 Posts
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Is it not the word 'See' as a verb that makes it sail instead of
sails
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| Sat, Jul 31 2010 02:05pm IST 4 |

Tony
1984 Posts
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Well, yes it is, Weens, but it can't be just present tense. If it
were it would take an 's' with a singular subject. 'Friend' is
actually the object of 'see'; 'sail across the river' is some sort
of subordinative clause, but I still don't know what part of speech
'sail' is.
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| Wed, Aug 18 2010 05:00pm IST 5 |

Persia
71 Posts
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Hi Tony! Sorry it's taken me so long to see this - pathetic, but
life gets too busy sometimes!
My gut reaction would be that "sail" is in the infinitive form
here; if you turned it into a question, "Do you see my friend sail
across the ocean?" the "do" helping verb pops up, making the "see"
the main verb. I haven't tested that against other examples, but
that's my "English teacher" instinct. I hope that helps!
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| Wed, Aug 18 2010 05:27pm IST 6 |

Tony
1984 Posts
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Infinitive, eh? Thanks, Persia. I hadn't realised you can have an
infinitive without the 'to', but that would certainly explain why
it never takes an 's'. So definitely not a participle without an
'ing', then?
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| Thu, Aug 19 2010 01:01am IST 7 |

Persia
71 Posts
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Definitely not a participle, which is a verb form that can act as
an adjective or a noun; since it's acting as a verb here (and not
even as a gerund, which is the -ing form of a noun), I'd bet on
infinitive (which can be with or without "to"). Tricky, that sail,
ain't it?
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| Wed, Mar 23 2011 10:00am GMT 8 |

Tony
1984 Posts
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I've just revisited this Persia, and I'm still wondering. If it had
been, 'See my friend about to sail across the river,' it is
obviously the infinitive and describes the moment before the
crossing starts. 'See my friend sail across the river,' however,
describes the actual crossing; it's a different sentence
altogether. Can we still definitely say that 'sail' is the same
part of speech in both instances?
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| Wed, Mar 23 2011 10:17am GMT 9 |

Barry Walsh
52 Posts
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Tony, Is it that sail, in speech at least, refers to 'him' (my
friend) which makes it sound fine and, even on the page, it looks
fine.
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| Wed, Mar 23 2011 10:49am GMT 10 |

Tony
1984 Posts
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Fine, it may be, PK, but I want to know what part of speech it is
- how to decline it.
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| Thu, Mar 24 2011 11:19am GMT 11 |

Persia
71 Posts
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Hi Tony! If by decline you mean conjugate, check out this link:
http://conjugator.reverso.net/conjugation-english-verb-sail.html
If that doesn't OD you on sailing, I don't know what will!

I still think the original sentence is the infinitive; anything
else wouldn't really make sense in that structure.
In the "about to" future structure, it's the "about to" that tells
you the action is forthcoming (rather than the infinitive + to
carrying that information); but the second example you give is
actually not time-specific; it could be itself a type of infinitive
structure, if that makes sense - it might be found in a poem, for
instance, when the timing is not as important as the action. In
either instance, it's still the verb. I might have even confused
myself this time around  , but I hope
that helps!
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| Thu, Mar 24 2011 11:36am GMT 12 |

Barry Walsh
52 Posts
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In that case Tony, I think it's similar to the simple French
imperative (to whoever is listening/reading) 'regarde/regardez mon
ami qui.... As for declension, I think that's it for the
imperative: just singular or plural versions.
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| Thu, Mar 24 2011 03:50pm GMT 13 |

Tony
1984 Posts
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That seems a great grammar site Persia. Thanks. Doesn't have my
example, though 
So, it's conjugate for verbs - and decline for nouns? It's a long
time since O-levels 
You could make up a joke about the noun that was held captive by
verbs but declined his conjugal rights.
PK: I did wonder about the imperative. The 'See' in the sentence is
imperative, but the 'sail' is not the same as the 'see', so I guess
it can't be that.
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| Fri, Mar 25 2011 11:29pm GMT 14 |

Persia
71 Posts
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You lost me.
Conjugate is for verbs; declension is for pronouns, nouns, articles
and adjectives (also known as an inflection): e.g. goose / geese;
Stephan / Stephanie; penny / pennies. Declension reflects gender,
number, or case. Just to make sure we're on the same page.
I'm not sure anymore what the question is, but I still think the
answer is infinitive.
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| Sun, May 15 2011 06:29pm IST 15 |

Mark Galliford
2 Posts
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It's a bare infinitive; that is, without 'to'. Think how you would
construct the sentence if the verb in question was 'to be'. "Watch
him be a compete idiot" not "Watch him is..." You can use the same
structure with help ("help me make it through the night"), make
("go on then, make me do it") , let ("Let me entertain you") and
many other verbs.
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| Sun, May 15 2011 10:10pm IST 16 |

Tony
1984 Posts
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Right, thanks, Mark. A 'bare infinitive'; I'd never heard of that,
but it sounds a good name for what it obviously is. Great!
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| Mon, Jun 6 2011 12:59am IST 17 |

Persia
71 Posts
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Ah, so you didn't lose me after all Tony  ; "bare"
infinitive is a name I've not heard in a LONG time, but it's what I
referred to as infinitive without the 'to', so thanks for
the confirmation, Mark!
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| Mon, Jun 6 2011 10:45am IST 18 |

Tony
1984 Posts
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Hi Persia, how are you? Well, I guess that just about wraps it up
then - 10 months on  . Thanks again to you
and Mark. (I bet The Kinks never knew what they had written!)
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